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I have Been Doing Some Thinking ....

Wed Apr 29, 2020 5:18 pm
"This is the best website for people with an Ostomy, hands down. So much understanding. Everyone should join."

Here are my musings:


The Stock Market – People get excited when the numbers are up but how many of those people actually have investments in stocks and bonds? For the average “Joe and Jill” these figures mean very little to nothing at all as many don’t have money to pay everyday bills let alone play the stock market. Plus, if I really was a wealthy corporate owner, I would put more money into automation, not workers. That’s a no brainer! On the other hand, big investors like big corporations and “governmenting” people jump for joy when the numbers go up.


TSFA – Sidetracking a bit, in Canada the TSFA, is a real gem. A Tax-Free Savings Account is a registered investment or savings account that allows for tax free gains. The amount of money that can be contributed to a TFSA is limited each year. A TFSA can be used for any savings goal and withdrawals can be made free of tax. The TFSA contribution limit for 2020 is $6,000. If you have never contributed to a TFSA you can deposit a total of $69,500. Unused contribution room rolls over from one year to the next. This amount is also retroactive.


To Secede or Not to Secede – California (5th largest economy in the world) Oregon and Washington State could secede for the other 47 states. On the other hand, your tax dollars are spent politicking on what should be a convid-19 briefing and putting one’s name on checks/letters.


Protesters – Those patriots that are protesting “back to work” and “open the economy” should sign a waiver first stating that if they, or any of their family members they come in contact with, contract the virus, they should be the very last to be treated. On the other hand, aren’t we are all in this together? As ostomates, our systems are already compromised.


The Illusive Covid Test – Testing 5 million people a day out of the approximately 230 million US population approximately is 0.0217391304347826 of the population. Do those that govern actually believe that we the people cannot do the math? On the other hand, I can bet dollars to donuts that the people getting testing regularly are the governmenting people and the big corporate people. They probably have their own personal ventilators and a “stockpile” of PPE. What happens when the heroic medical staff re-think going in without proper PPE?

 
Wait - What! - And what’s with those NOT social distancing people on the beaches or those people trying to cure the virus with consuming bleach or disinfectants! Really? I guess there are some things more important than living. Which elected officials uttered that hogwash? And speaking of pork …


Back to Work Order – Some ‘portant person ORDERED meat plant workers back to work. This simply means the worker cannot sue if they contract the virus and die from it. On the other hand, ordering the minions/workers back will please the wealthy owners. Is life worth a sizzling pork chop or a hamburger pattie?


Anybody ever watch “Hunger Games?” (spoiler alert – the rich people watched the poor people die for their entertainment.) 


On the other hand, the virus will not respect the US-Canadian border. What happens in the US does not stay in the US. To reiterate, aren’t we all in this together.  Anyway, this is what happens when I have time on my hands … I start thinking. A little knowledge can be a dangerous thing.


Karen

Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:27 pm

Hey KMed,

I love your post! On the mark as always.

Xerxes

MeetAnOstoMate - 26,936 members
Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:42 pm

back when i was quite a bit younger, i was a volunteer fireman for a small town. we were paid 25$ each time we were called out and showed up. we wore a pager type thing back in those day before cell phones. when we got a call the thing would go off with an alarm, followed by the address of the problem...could be a wreck, could be a house fire, could be a brush fire. when the alarm went off i started to my truck...i did not try to figure out who`s house might be on fire, i did not calculate my chanches of getting hurt or possible even being killed. I WENT TO THE DAMNED FIRE... if i got there quick enough, i put on my gear and WENT IN THE FIRE. we went to the fire with the purpose of putting it out, we stayed till the fire was out..........your telling me a meat packer or some other essential worker cant go to work for the next 6 months because  HE MIGHT GET SICK with something that has a 97% survivabiliy rate ? i`m calling BULLSHIT   rant off


Wed Apr 29, 2020 6:44 pm

Karen, some of those same thoughts keep me up at night. I too get very nervous about some states opening too soon and too quickly; and, as you said, the virus doesn't recognize borders.

On your thoughts about the stock market, we are all tied to the markets in one way or another. If you have RRSPs, a pension from work, or even the Canada Pension Plan are all affected by the markets, so we all want the markets to be healthy. But not at the expense of human beings. 

Don't apologize for thinking - the world could use more of that just now. 

Laurie


Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:17 pm
mild_mannered_super_hero wrote:

back when i was quite a bit younger, i was a volunteer fireman for a small town. we were paid 25$ each time we were called out and showed up. we wore a pager type thing back in those day before cell phones. when we got a call the thing would go off with an alarm, followed by the address of the problem...could be a wreck, could be a house fire, could be a brush fire. when the alarm went off i started to my truck...i did not try to figure out who`s house might be on fire, i did not calculate my chanches of getting hurt or possible even being killed. I WENT TO THE DAMNED FIRE... if i got there quick enough, i put on my gear and WENT IN THE FIRE. we went to the fire with the purpose of putting it out, we stayed till the fire was out..........your telling me a meat packer or some other essential worker cant go to work for the next 6 months because  HE MIGHT GET SICK with something that has a 97% survivabiliy rate ? i`m calling BULLSHIT   rant off


OK, there's a huge difference between the danger involved in firefighting and meat packing. While I sincerely appreciate your altruism in choosing to volunteer to fight fires, remember that it was a choice. I'm guessing that meat packers didn't consider their job to be life threatening when they made their career choice. As for the survivability rate, that varies from one district to the next, and one job to the next, and we don't know yet what the actual survivability of this will be in the US. In any case, it's still a game of Russian Roulette. Some people are more susceptible than others; some people will suffer more than others, and we can't really predict how individuals will fare, or whether they will survive it or not. If I were one of those meat packers, I would want to know specifically how the government that ordered me to play Russian Roulette is going to keep me safe. There is a lot of rhetoric floating around just now, and it seems to be pretty short on details. Sure, food is essential, I get that. But here's a thing: my life is pretty essential to me, and I'm betting that those meat packers feel the same way about their lives. Instead of getting angry at people who didn't sign up to die on the job, shouldn't we be asking how we can prevent them from dying whilst they are doing their job? And demanding that the politicians who were elected to look out for the safety of their constituents do exactly that? 

Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:20 pm
mild_mannered_super_hero wrote:

back when i was quite a bit younger, i was a volunteer fireman for a small town. we were paid 25$ each time we were called out and showed up. we wore a pager type thing back in those day before cell phones. when we got a call the thing would go off with an alarm, followed by the address of the problem...could be a wreck, could be a house fire, could be a brush fire. when the alarm went off i started to my truck...i did not try to figure out who`s house might be on fire, i did not calculate my chanches of getting hurt or possible even being killed. I WENT TO THE DAMNED FIRE... if i got there quick enough, i put on my gear and WENT IN THE FIRE. we went to the fire with the purpose of putting it out, we stayed till the fire was out..........your telling me a meat packer or some other essential worker cant go to work for the next 6 months because  HE MIGHT GET SICK with something that has a 97% survivabiliy rate ? i`m calling BULLSHIT   rant off

Hi MMSH,


Ahhh ... there is life on this site again. Rant appreciated:)

People can see both sides of the coin, when people disagree, so your reply is necessary so that we don't succumb to group think. The more opinions there are, no matter differing, the better.

It's not about the money. It’s not about the profession. It is not even a question of duty. When people go into harm's way, they should be fully protected. You could see and feel the fire. Essential service workers cannot see the virus and if they unfortunately contracted it in the worst possible way, it is not felt until it is too late.

Let's hope more tests become a prerequisite to returning to work and that a vaccine for this dratted virus is found soon.

Long time no speak;  you were a great source of my success  (and others) in irrigating, thanks. Stay well.


Karen

Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:24 pm
Padfoot wrote:

Karen, some of those same thoughts keep me up at night. I too get very nervous about some states opening too soon and too quickly; and, as you said, the virus doesn't recognize borders.

On your thoughts about the stock market, we are all tied to the markets in one way or another. If you have RRSPs, a pension from work, or even the Canada Pension Plan are all affected by the markets, so we all want the markets to be healthy. But not at the expense of human beings. 

Don't apologize for thinking - the world could use more of that just now. 

Laurie


Hey Laurie,

I forgot about those trickle-down investments in your comment ..."If you have RRSPs, a pension from work, or even the Canada Pension Plan are all affected by the markets, so we all want the markets to be healthy." You are so right.  Your side of coin - awesome.

Karen

Wed Apr 29, 2020 7:29 pm
Xerxes wrote:

Hey KMed,

I love your post! On the mark as always.

Xerxes


OMG. Nice to connect. Still fishing in your retirement daze.   No pork or beef- might as well keep fishing:) Take care. Karen

Wed Apr 29, 2020 8:00 pm

Kmedup, 

There's nothing wrong with your thinking.  Nice post !

Angelicamarie

Wed Apr 29, 2020 9:24 pm
Angelicamarie wrote:

Kmedup, 

There's nothing wrong with your thinking.  Nice post !

Angelicamarie


Hi Angelicamarie,


I come from a fairly pollical family. My uncle was acclaimed as MLA (legislature member) for thirty years – no one ran against him. My best friend, a MLA, held numerous portfolios (cabinet positions) over a decade as well. My ex’s cousin, at one time, was the Deputy Prime Minister of Canada, Don Mazankowski. We only met a few times, at political rallies so I can’t name drop there. There are other friends, in-laws and out-laws etcetera in the “business.” I have door-knocked, answered phones, took voters to vote, was a scrutinizer and returning officer for more times than I care to remember, held several board positions, and volunteered for many hopeful candidates for over three decades – even for the opposition. My livelihood often depended on grants so I had to know what the individual parties and individual candidates stood for or stood against.

I have come to realize, unfortunately, that the best way to distract people was by “dividing and conquering.” The Romans did that well. Getting the sides angry, no mad, no peed off at each other … and well, anything can be accomplished, all the while the sides are blindly arguing. Often families were split and spent many years not speaking to each other. I also learned if one could keep their citizens “simple stupid,” it was easier to control and slyly convince to come around to their way of seeing things. Hence the need for a super strong education system for each generation. This is more important now, than ever.

That is why I am a strong promoter of education and everyone having and expressing their opinions while respecting those of others … else we fall into a customized trap, unbeknownst to us, while things are happening. While I am typing this reply, these words are popping into my head … “Ours is not to question why, ours is just to do or die. Into the valley …” you get what I mean.


Karen

Wed Apr 29, 2020 10:41 pm
Padfoot wrote:


OK, there's a huge difference between the danger involved in firefighting and meat packing. While I sincerely appreciate your altruism in choosing to volunteer to fight fires, remember that it was a choice. I'm guessing that meat packers didn't consider their job to be life threatening when they made their career choice. As for the survivability rate, that varies from one district to the next, and one job to the next, and we don't know yet what the actual survivability of this will be in the US. In any case, it's still a game of Russian Roulette. Some people are more susceptible than others; some people will suffer more than others, and we can't really predict how individuals will fare, or whether they will survive it or not. If I were one of those meat packers, I would want to know specifically how the government that ordered me to play Russian Roulette is going to keep me safe. There is a lot of rhetoric floating around just now, and it seems to be pretty short on details. Sure, food is essential, I get that. But here's a thing: my life is pretty essential to me, and I'm betting that those meat packers feel the same way about their lives. Instead of getting angry at people who didn't sign up to die on the job, shouldn't we be asking how we can prevent them from dying whilst they are doing their job? And demanding that the politicians who were elected to look out for the safety of their constituents do exactly that? 


I would like to add that masks, gloves, and gowns are disposable, people should not be, K.

Thu Apr 30, 2020 1:22 am

Oh boy....where to start? K's on a tear....

Stock market. If Joe and Jill are like millions of other Americans they have a retirement plan that involves an annuity of some sort. Annuities work by investing members contributions in a variety of stock market funds. Most funds are diversified, so Joe and Jill don't gave to watch the market everyday......they take comfort in the fact that over time the market continues to increase in value, which drives their funds' share prices higher, which increases their retirement funds. Now if you were a wealthy corporate business owner and invested heavily in automation instead of cheap labor......you might not be very wealthy for long. Automation is very expensive, the machinery requires maintenance, and has a definitive service life, at which point it has to be replaced (assuming it's not made obsolete first). The control systems and software continually advance and at a point the computer hardware running the constantly updated software becomes obsolete and no longer supported. Think of it this way.......if you buy a multi-million dollar piece of machinery to replace 25 people making minimum wage......you might wear out the machine before you've even broke even. And if one or two people call in sick you could see output reduce by less than 10% on those days. If your automation machine goes down you loose 100% of your output until it's fixed. Automation doesn't always make sense everywhere.

Can't comment on TSFA.

Sucession requires a Constitutional amendment. That means it would need to be approved by two-thirds majorities in the both the House and Senate. Then it requires at least 38 state's legislatures to ratify. It's not going to happen in our lifetime. But it would be cool if it did. With California's electoral votes out of the picture there would never be another Democratic President in the US!

Protesters. Ok.....they should be the last to be treated. But if they develop herd immunity or are immune to the virus......and you want their antibodies to treat those who are really sick....they should be allowed to name their price. Deal?

Covid testing. Hmm.........I'm one of those "governmenting people" and I've never been tested. Neither have any of the 150 other people I go to work with every day. We have/had no stockpile and sent all our PPE to our local hospital weeks ago. We each kept one mask, which we've been wearing every day since. We have no ventilators and our base hospital was closed years ago when the Dems decided to shrink our military. What happens when the heroic medical staff re-think going in without proper PPE? Heros don't think that way....that's why they're heroes. Can't really explain it better than that. You either are one....or you're not.

"people trying to cure the virus with consuming bleach or disinfectants"...........nah....no comment . You surely won't like my view on nature eliminating the stupid ones from the gene pool.

"Back to Work Order – Some ‘portant person ORDERED meat plant workers back to work. This simply means the worker cannot sue if they contract the virus and die from it. On the other hand, ordering the minions/workers back will please the wealthy owners. Is life worth a sizzling pork chop or a hamburger pattie?". Silly rabbit.......you need to stop believing the fake news headlines. Trump did no such thing. What he did was to invoke the Defense Production Act to classify meat plants as essential infrastructure that must remain open. The order says the government will provide additional protective gear for employees as well as guidance, it doesn't say individuals have to come to work. If you want to see some real carnage.....let the food chain be broken and then watch the panic that will ensue. Thanks for reminding me...I need to order a few more thousand rounds of .556 NATO for my AR10. Need to protect my chickens from the starving hoards.

Did I miss anything? Oh yeah...your last point. I agree wholeheartedly!

Just kidding.....you know I luv ya!

Regards,

Bob

Thu Apr 30, 2020 1:52 am

Hello Karen.

I do like your post and the fact that it has attracted differing responses from different people. I have recently filled a book with my rhyming musings including the subjects you raise.  Many of my rhymes feature politicians because they seem to epitomise the essence of 'bullying' and they also often appear to use anything and everything as 'weapons' in their bullying games(including 'money' and the the law). I was spoilt for choice as to which rhyme to share on this occasion, but given the Covid scene presently upon us, I chose one to include this theme as well as that of bullying. 

PS: A very long time ago, when I was at college, I recall being asked 'What drugs have killed most people?' My reply was 'Tea and coffee'. Those were during the days when the British colonialists were still working indigenous people to death so that they could profiteer from these crops. It seems to be slightly better nowadays, but the principles remain the same. 

Best wishes

Bill

A BULLYING SCOURGE.

There is a new scourge on the block,
seemingly threatening to knock
bullying from off the top spot
but I will tell you why it’s not.

The scourge that I refer to is
something that’s got us in a tizz,
because it’s killing people and
it’s starting to get out of hand.

A virus is the latest scourge
to make us humans want to purge
it from our own community
as we don’t have immunity.

Well, I can tell you this my friend,
that bullying did not just end,
and though it’s something we deny
bullies have made millions die.

Just like this virus, bullies will
be worse for those both frail and ill,
or those who are disenfranchised,
marginalized and despised.

The vulnerable will suffer more,
and this is something we deplore
when viruses are the main cause,
yet, when it’s bullies, there’s applause.

The bullies seem to have a need
to keep advancing their own greed,
to the detriment of the poor
and they have enshrined this in law.

This virus will kill some folks off,
but nowhere near those that the toffs
have by their actions, made to die,
and never bothered asking why.

                                  B. Withers 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:15 am

Well said K

We may not live in America but we certainly do have the right to our own concerns about being a sneeze away from the U.S. borders when they open again..Canada is in lockdown too however; we do not go on redneck protests with BIG GUNS and big bully motorbikes to open it up again and our government isn't sending people into the slaughter house to die like the goof. .Ohhhhhhhh sorry I should say President Trump.

Ange 

Oh I know this will cause more rants but whatever!

Thu Apr 30, 2020 2:39 am
Bill wrote:

Hello Karen.

I do like your post and the fact that it has attracted differing responses from different people. I have recently filled a book with my rhyming musings including the subjects you raise.  Many of my rhymes feature politicians because they seem to epitomise the essence of 'bullying' and they also often appear to use anything and everything as 'weapons' in their bullying games(including 'money' and the the law). I was spoilt for choice as to which rhyme to share on this occasion, but given the Covid scene presently upon us, I chose one to include this theme as well as that of bullying. 

PS: A very long time ago, when I was at college, I recall being asked 'What drugs have killed most people?' My reply was 'Tea and coffee'. Those were during the days when the British colonialists were still working indigenous people to death so that they could profiteer from these crops. It seems to be slightly better nowadays, but the principles remain the same. 

Best wishes

Bill

A BULLYING SCOURGE.

There is a new scourge on the block,
seemingly threatening to knock
bullying from off the top spot
but I will tell you why it’s not.

The scourge that I refer to is
something that’s got us in a tizz,
because it’s killing people and
it’s starting to get out of hand.

A virus is the latest scourge
to make us humans want to purge
it from our own community
as we don’t have immunity.

Well, I can tell you this my friend,
that bullying did not just end,
and though it’s something we deny
bullies have made millions die.

Just like this virus, bullies will
be worse for those both frail and ill,
or those who are disenfranchised,
marginalized and despised.

The vulnerable will suffer more,
and this is something we deplore
when viruses are the main cause,
yet, when it’s bullies, there’s applause.

The bullies seem to have a need
to keep advancing their own greed,
to the detriment of the poor
and they have enshrined this in law.

This virus will kill some folks off,
but nowhere near those that the toffs
have by their actions, made to die,
and never bothered asking why.

                                  B. Withers 2020

You are such an innovative treasure Bill. Poetry is your thing:) And where can this book be found?

I enjoy the symbiotic relationships on this site, even if I manage to annoy some mates, as we can all learn a tad from each other. "We are as strong as our weakest link." one of my professors used to proclaim. He also taught me to put that square peg in the round hole. "Make it work," I can remember him saying. Several months later, armed and dangerous with a degree in one hand and good intentions in the other and just shy of 22, I was off to my first post with CUSO - Papua New Guinea. What a slice! https://cusointernational.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/catalyst_emagazine_en.pdf

Karen

Thu Apr 30, 2020 3:00 am
w30bob wrote:

Oh boy....where to start? K's on a tear....

Stock market. If Joe and Jill are like millions of other Americans they have a retirement plan that involves an annuity of some sort. Annuities work by investing members contributions in a variety of stock market funds. Most funds are diversified, so Joe and Jill don't gave to watch the market everyday......they take comfort in the fact that over time the market continues to increase in value, which drives their funds' share prices higher, which increases their retirement funds. Now if you were a wealthy corporate business owner and invested heavily in automation instead of cheap labor......you might not be very wealthy for long. Automation is very expensive, the machinery requires maintenance, and has a definitive service life, at which point it has to be replaced (assuming it's not made obsolete first). The control systems and software continually advance and at a point the computer hardware running the constantly updated software becomes obsolete and no longer supported. Think of it this way.......if you buy a multi-million dollar piece of machinery to replace 25 people making minimum wage......you might wear out the machine before you've even broke even. And if one or two people call in sick you could see output reduce by less than 10% on those days. If your automation machine goes down you loose 100% of your output until it's fixed. Automation doesn't always make sense everywhere.

Can't comment on TSFA.

Sucession requires a Constitutional amendment. That means it would need to be approved by two-thirds majorities in the both the House and Senate. Then it requires at least 38 state's legislatures to ratify. It's not going to happen in our lifetime. But it would be cool if it did. With California's electoral votes out of the picture there would never be another Democratic President in the US!

Protesters. Ok.....they should be the last to be treated. But if they develop herd immunity or are immune to the virus......and you want their antibodies to treat those who are really sick....they should be allowed to name their price. Deal?

Covid testing. Hmm.........I'm one of those "governmenting people" and I've never been tested. Neither have any of the 150 other people I go to work with every day. We have/had no stockpile and sent all our PPE to our local hospital weeks ago. We each kept one mask, which we've been wearing every day since. We have no ventilators and our base hospital was closed years ago when the Dems decided to shrink our military. What happens when the heroic medical staff re-think going in without proper PPE? Heros don't think that way....that's why they're heroes. Can't really explain it better than that. You either are one....or you're not.

"people trying to cure the virus with consuming bleach or disinfectants"...........nah....no comment . You surely won't like my view on nature eliminating the stupid ones from the gene pool.

"Back to Work Order – Some ‘portant person ORDERED meat plant workers back to work. This simply means the worker cannot sue if they contract the virus and die from it. On the other hand, ordering the minions/workers back will please the wealthy owners. Is life worth a sizzling pork chop or a hamburger pattie?". Silly rabbit.......you need to stop believing the fake news headlines. Trump did no such thing. What he did was to invoke the Defense Production Act to classify meat plants as essential infrastructure that must remain open. The order says the government will provide additional protective gear for employees as well as guidance, it doesn't say individuals have to come to work. If you want to see some real carnage.....let the food chain be broken and then watch the panic that will ensue. Thanks for reminding me...I need to order a few more thousand rounds of .556 NATO for my AR10. Need to protect my chickens from the starving hoards.

Did I miss anything? Oh yeah...your last point. I agree wholeheartedly!

Just kidding.....you know I luv ya!

Regards,

Bob

H--eh Bob!  It's 1:00 am in the morning here. I haveta getta good nights sleep before I tackle your apropos reply:) K

Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:04 am
Padfoot wrote:


OK, there's a huge difference between the danger involved in firefighting and meat packing. While I sincerely appreciate your altruism in choosing to volunteer to fight fires, remember that it was a choice. I'm guessing that meat packers didn't consider their job to be life threatening when they made their career choice. 


there is no difference in being dead from a fire, or starving to death. there are many jobs that are essential and when your a big boy or girl you put on your big boy pants and do the job.  at least thats what we do here in america. president trump gets up and goes to work every day, hes not suggesting others do anything he isnt doing himself. people in rural areas are ready and willing to return to work, to shut everything  down till this is completly over is suicide for the whole counrty


Thu Apr 30, 2020 6:58 am

Sorry MMSH, but I don't see Trump putting himself in harms way. Bone spurs, and all. The meat packers are protesting that they don't have enough protective gear to do their job safely; we'll see if the back to work order really addresses that. It's not even being addressed adequately for healthcare workers. You may have fought fires, but at least you were able to put on your "gear". And you knew what you had signed up for. Meat packers, like I said before, didn't think they were putting their lives on the line when they signed up. And it has nothing to do with being a big boy or girl; it has everything to do with safety.

Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:12 am

Hi all wow great discussion, and nobody calling anybody names like facebook, i,m in the dump trump pack and i cant believe my friends that say he,s the best thing since sliced bread, come on who in their right mind asks if disinfectant can be used internally, maybe he was asking for a friend lol but seriously when people are dieing at ten times the rate of flu even if you thow out the heart attack or death from cancer. as for the stock market i got burned in the last recession in o8-o9 but with some aggressive investing i was able to recover what was lost and gained a little more before retiring. comparing vol. fire fighting to an everyday job is comparing apples and oranges. my 2cents.

Thu Apr 30, 2020 8:35 am

Your thinking is taking you in the right direction. Many people are of the opinion that the world will not be the same as BC (Before Corona) when all this is over. The TSFA sounds good. More countries should have schemes like that. The stock market is usually not a good place for small investors, they are the first ones to lose when it turns bearish. Money begets money in that arena. However, investing in companies that have anything to do with developing vaccines is not a bad idea. Sooner or later a vaccine against this scourge will come out. Another noticeable difference is found among those in isolation, some have found solace in exploring their inner selves while others are lonely and adrift. I lie somewhere between these two categories. Stay safe everyone.

Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:52 am

Hello Karen. I too have been doing some thinking during this pandemic (which I accept has not been a 'hoax'!!).

And, as I am in a very high risk category due to several different factors, it inevitably makes me wonder what the future holds on a very personal level.

Now, don't get me wrong! Dying has never been much of worry for me, except in the sense that I would want to be in control of the process for myself, rather than have someone (or something) else, dictate the process. 

What is always more concerning is whether my books will be published before my demise. I have three on the go at present; The most important one is 'Bullying - book4', which is now complete; the second is 'Rhymes on rhymes' which is well on the way, along with the last one which has a working title of 'Whext'. ( which is a collection of rhymes on a variety of subjects that do not fit into the other two. 

The verse chosen to share below, was written today to be the last one in 'Rhymes on Rhymes' and begins to address the vulnerability of folks like us, who have no way of knowing if we'll make it to the other side or these uncertain times. 

Thanks so much for posting such an open forum subject, so that we may all express our views on this subject in whatever way we think fit.

Best wishes 

Bill

YESTERDAY’S RHYME.

All those rhymes I wrote before,
I now believe are nothing more
than the musings of someone
who feels his writing days are done.

This year has seen a virus spread
around the old, and now they’re dead,
and as I’m old, I have to think
that perhaps I am on the brink.

Whilst I am in isolation
it provides the motivation
for writing more rhymes than I could
if I were working like I should.

This social distancing for me
has made me like a detainee,
but, in fact, has set me free
to write a lot more poetry.

I hope that as you took a look
at this last rhyme within in this book,
you’ll spare a thought for all those who
worked to help you all pull through.

So many folks have passed away,
no one can tell when it’s their day,
or whether they will weather it
to the point where it will quit.

There is no point to wonder if
I will end up as a stiff,
because if this becomes my fate,
I hope my poems won’t be late.

So, here I am, just marking time,
compiling and typing my rhyme,
in the hope that it might be
published before the end of me.

                               B. Withers 2020

Thu Apr 30, 2020 11:29 am
mild_mannered_super_hero wrote:


there is no difference in being dead from a fire, or starving to death. there are many jobs that are essential and when your a big boy or girl you put on your big boy pants and do the job.  at least thats what we do here in america. president trump gets up and goes to work every day, hes not suggesting others do anything he isnt doing himself. people in rural areas are ready and willing to return to work, to shut everything  down till this is completly over is suicide for the whole counrty


Sorry, this may be way off topic but Zeppo, yes that Zeppo on this site, sent me a link that had me shed a tear or two or three - ok, I am still teary-eyed. It was created only on April 24, 2020. The link is a bit trying so in case the link doesn't work the title is Clark W. -Up Here in Canada  https://www.google.com/search?q=Clark+w.+up+Here%2C+in+Canada&oq=Clark+w.+up+Here%2C+in+Canada&aqs=chrome..69i57.1880j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8 
 

On the other hand, it just made me think calmly and humoroulsy ... Now back to my coffee and crying and sort of thinking how I am gonna answer Bob - eh!  Karen

Thu Apr 30, 2020 12:46 pm
Bill wrote:

Hello Karen. I too have been doing some thinking during this pandemic (which I accept has not been a 'hoax'!!).

And, as I am in a very high risk category due to several different factors, it inevitably makes me wonder what the future holds on a very personal level.

Now, don't get me wrong! Dying has never been much of worry for me, except in the sense that I would want to be in control of the process for myself, rather than have someone (or something) else, dictate the process. 

What is always more concerning is whether my books will be published before my demise. I have three on the go at present; The most important one is 'Bullying - book4', which is now complete; the second is 'Rhymes on rhymes' which is well on the way, along with the last one which has a working title of 'Whext'. ( which is a collection of rhymes on a variety of subjects that do not fit into the other two. 

The verse chosen to share below, was written today to be the last one in 'Rhymes on Rhymes' and begins to address the vulnerability of folks like us, who have no way of knowing if we'll make it to the other side or these uncertain times. 

Thanks so much for posting such an open forum subject, so that we may all express our views on this subject in whatever way we think fit.

Best wishes 

Bill

YESTERDAY’S RHYME.

All those rhymes I wrote before,
I now believe are nothing more
than the musings of someone
who feels his writing days are done.

This year has seen a virus spread
around the old, and now they’re dead,
and as I’m old, I have to think
that perhaps I am on the brink.

Whilst I am in isolation
it provides the motivation
for writing more rhymes than I could
if I were working like I should.

This social distancing for me
has made me like a detainee,
but, in fact, has set me free
to write a lot more poetry.

I hope that as you took a look
at this last rhyme within in this book,
you’ll spare a thought for all those who
worked to help you all pull through.

So many folks have passed away,
no one can tell when it’s their day,
or whether they will weather it
to the point where it will quit.

There is no point to wonder if
I will end up as a stiff,
because if this becomes my fate,
I hope my poems won’t be late.

So, here I am, just marking time,
compiling and typing my rhyme,
in the hope that it might be
published before the end of me.

                               B. Withers 2020

Hi Bill,


Back in 2013 my 80-year-old mom, whining lovingly in conversation one day, said, “I’m bored; I need something to do. I have so many stories in my head, I can’t stop dreaming about.” Without thinking I replied, “So, write a book.” Be careful what one says while thinking out loud. She did and up until the day she died on March 22, 2020, of a cardiac arrest, she was still writing – no computer knowledge – just arthritic hands, a bunch of re-sharpened pencils, and erasers her late cowboy husband’s tattered dictionary and fierce willpower to leave something behind for us kids. To live for 87 years with no major medical conditions is something we all wish for and she did say, when her number was up, please let it be quick. She got her wish.

Publishing is a bugger so as a family we collectively got this done for her. I did the editing, my son and girlfriend (over a bottle or two of wine) along with one of my former Indigenous students did the illustrating. My daughter and boyfriend knew a publisher in Victoria and the rest is “her - story.” Each book “title” appeared magically as she was writing so thinking about a suitable name for each book was easy. Now for the cover. My daughter’s friend who animates for Disney offered to paint her two covers for 24 jars of her fabulous dill pickles. Ogden Nash’s poetry appeared here and there in the first book. In the back of both were her scrumptious decade-appropriate recipes. “Behind the Kitchen Stove” (growing up in a family of 22) and “Even Cow’s Cry” (the life of a rancher’s wife) have become her legacy. That cow on that second book is our, "Moo...na Lisa."

Her humor shone through everything she did and in her own small way she bought smiles to the faces of people in retirement and nursing homes along with many others. Not using many names, each reader could see themselves in her shoes. She passed away not even realizing that in Alberta, she was a best-seller. That was not her purpose. She began drawing and painting a few years back so she could illustrate her next two books which unfortunately remain unfinished. Without stories from our seniors, a little bit of history disappears. Now, for another cry. Press on Bill. If there is a will there is a way. Karen


Thu Apr 30, 2020 9:28 pm
w30bob wrote:

Oh boy....where to start? K's on a tear....

Stock market. If Joe and Jill are like millions of other Americans they have a retirement plan that involves an annuity of some sort. Annuities work by investing members contributions in a variety of stock market funds. Most funds are diversified, so Joe and Jill don't gave to watch the market everyday......they take comfort in the fact that over time the market continues to increase in value, which drives their funds' share prices higher, which increases their retirement funds. Now if you were a wealthy corporate business owner and invested heavily in automation instead of cheap labor......you might not be very wealthy for long. Automation is very expensive, the machinery requires maintenance, and has a definitive service life, at which point it has to be replaced (assuming it's not made obsolete first). The control systems and software continually advance and at a point the computer hardware running the constantly updated software becomes obsolete and no longer supported. Think of it this way.......if you buy a multi-million dollar piece of machinery to replace 25 people making minimum wage......you might wear out the machine before you've even broke even. And if one or two people call in sick you could see output reduce by less than 10% on those days. If your automation machine goes down you loose 100% of your output until it's fixed. Automation doesn't always make sense everywhere.

Can't comment on TSFA.

Sucession requires a Constitutional amendment. That means it would need to be approved by two-thirds majorities in the both the House and Senate. Then it requires at least 38 state's legislatures to ratify. It's not going to happen in our lifetime. But it would be cool if it did. With California's electoral votes out of the picture there would never be another Democratic President in the US!

Protesters. Ok.....they should be the last to be treated. But if they develop herd immunity or are immune to the virus......and you want their antibodies to treat those who are really sick....they should be allowed to name their price. Deal?

Covid testing. Hmm.........I'm one of those "governmenting people" and I've never been tested. Neither have any of the 150 other people I go to work with every day. We have/had no stockpile and sent all our PPE to our local hospital weeks ago. We each kept one mask, which we've been wearing every day since. We have no ventilators and our base hospital was closed years ago when the Dems decided to shrink our military. What happens when the heroic medical staff re-think going in without proper PPE? Heros don't think that way....that's why they're heroes. Can't really explain it better than that. You either are one....or you're not.

"people trying to cure the virus with consuming bleach or disinfectants"...........nah....no comment . You surely won't like my view on nature eliminating the stupid ones from the gene pool.

"Back to Work Order – Some ‘portant person ORDERED meat plant workers back to work. This simply means the worker cannot sue if they contract the virus and die from it. On the other hand, ordering the minions/workers back will please the wealthy owners. Is life worth a sizzling pork chop or a hamburger pattie?". Silly rabbit.......you need to stop believing the fake news headlines. Trump did no such thing. What he did was to invoke the Defense Production Act to classify meat plants as essential infrastructure that must remain open. The order says the government will provide additional protective gear for employees as well as guidance, it doesn't say individuals have to come to work. If you want to see some real carnage.....let the food chain be broken and then watch the panic that will ensue. Thanks for reminding me...I need to order a few more thousand rounds of .556 NATO for my AR10. Need to protect my chickens from the starving hoards.

Did I miss anything? Oh yeah...your last point. I agree wholeheartedly!

Just kidding.....you know I luv ya!

Regards,

Bob

H-eh Bob,

It is interesting how we can communicate while not really agreeing on much at all. You make some excellent points which I do appreciate - no group-think here:)  You never cease to amaze me; I never know what to expect when there is a reply from you.  You stay safe at work especially when there is only one mask - eh!  I am waiting to hear how you have been doing on the dating scene - your next goal, remember? Anyway ... does anyone have a cool old barn? Stay safe my friend, K.  No more rants from me, at least for awhile, as it is back to work again. No rest for the wicked! Zoom is calling!

Fri May 01, 2020 1:44 am
kmedup wrote:

Hi Bill,


Back in 2013 my 80-year-old mom, whining lovingly in conversation one day, said, “I’m bored; I need something to do. I have so many stories in my head, I can’t stop dreaming about.” Without thinking I replied, “So, write a book.” Be careful what one says while thinking out loud. She did and up until the day she died on March 22, 2020, of a cardiac arrest, she was still writing – no computer knowledge – just arthritic hands, a bunch of re-sharpened pencils, and erasers her late cowboy husband’s tattered dictionary and fierce willpower to leave something behind for us kids. To live for 87 years with no major medical conditions is something we all wish for and she did say, when her number was up, please let it be quick. She got her wish.

Publishing is a bugger so as a family we collectively got this done for her. I did the editing, my son and girlfriend (over a bottle or two of wine) along with one of my former Indigenous students did the illustrating. My daughter and boyfriend knew a publisher in Victoria and the rest is “her - story.” Each book “title” appeared magically as she was writing so thinking about a suitable name for each book was easy. Now for the cover. My daughter’s friend who animates for Disney offered to paint her two covers for 24 jars of her fabulous dill pickles. Ogden Nash’s poetry appeared here and there in the first book. In the back of both were her scrumptious decade-appropriate recipes. “Behind the Kitchen Stove” (growing up in a family of 22) and “Even Cow’s Cry” (the life of a rancher’s wife) have become her legacy. That cow on that second book is our, "Moo...na Lisa."

Her humor shone through everything she did and in her own small way she bought smiles to the faces of people in retirement and nursing homes along with many others. Not using many names, each reader could see themselves in her shoes. She passed away not even realizing that in Alberta, she was a best-seller. That was not her purpose. She began drawing and painting a few years back so she could illustrate her next two books which unfortunately remain unfinished. Without stories from our seniors, a little bit of history disappears. Now, for another cry. Press on Bill. If there is a will there is a way. Karen


Hello Karen.
Thank you so much for sharing the story about your mum. I can empathise with her and your feelings on writing and publishing, which can be difficult if you have not been there and done that before.
I can also feel for those folks who have stories they wish to tell and leave as legacies. Not everyone has the ability to express themselves in the written form, so your mother was obviously fortunate in that respect.
Having met so many people who have had interesting and noteworthy (if traumatic) experiences in life, I decided many years ago that the very least I could do was to try to capture their concepts and stories in verse.
It so happens that one of my latest books is a compilation of verses on rhyming verse, so below is one in which I try to capture the essence of writing to encapsulate what other’s tell me about their problems.
Best wishes
Bill

WEENIE WAILS OF WOE.

If you depart my little home
try, just before you go,
to impart your minor moans
and weenie wails of woe.

For these will help me formulate
a poem, just for you,
and please this craving to create
another verse or two.

All those feelings I collect,
rearranging into rhyme,
moving meanings to connect
in space and place and time.

I wish my words would put things right
if only for a day.
If they were heard, perhaps they might,
when wound and bound this way.

A rhyme in time can mend your mind
when you are sorely pained,
for in those lines, you often find
so many things explained.

The sea on which a sonnet sails
has dangers by the score.
Yet it seems, it rarely fails
to tame the tempest’s roar.

So, when life’s waves, all churn up rough,
and cannot get much worse,
a poet’s pen might be enough
to turn things round in-verse.

                            B. Withers (1993)

Fri May 01, 2020 3:57 pm
kmedup wrote:

H-eh Bob,

It is interesting how we can communicate while not really agreeing on much at all. You make some excellent points which I do appreciate - no group-think here:)  You never cease to amaze me; I never know what to expect when there is a reply from you.  You stay safe at work especially when there is only one mask - eh!  I am waiting to hear how you have been doing on the dating scene - your next goal, remember? Anyway ... does anyone have a cool old barn? Stay safe my friend, K.  No more rants from me, at least for awhile, as it is back to work again. No rest for the wicked! Zoom is calling!

Hi K,

  Whoa...........I saw the brevity of your reply and was initially saddened...........but then saw you artfully tucked a few compliments in there (well done, by the way) and it's all good!  Yes, ADULTS can disagree on things and not have to go stomping out of the room or flaming each other......so I do like our conversations.  It shows real restraint to not fall into the trap of being closed minded about things. I'm amazed at how much of the general population feels so strongly about a topic that they can't see that when you stop listening to other viewpoints you stop learning.....and you have therefore declare yourself an expert that knows everything there is to know about that subject.  And that's sad. 

  So I will do my best to continue to amaze you.  I found that women love to be amazed.  They get bored with "routine" very quickly, and I can't say I blame them.  Of course there's a fine line between being a "jerk" and being "amazing".....but it's a good challenge.  More guys should try it. 

  Dating.  Yeah, that's a head scratcher.  I've been on Match.com for the past year.  In that whole time I've only reached out to 2 women.  I don't do that whole "email every hot chick you see and play the odds that at least a couple will reply" thing.  Not my style.  I'm not looking to get dates for the sake of dating......just don't have the time or desire to deal with all those nutcases.  I've only reached out to those two women because none of the others were "interesting" to me.  Lots of lookers, but let's face it......we're on the downside of the curve, so no one is going to be getting better looking as they age.  So looks, while important for the initial attraction, need to have some substance behind them or I can't see a long term relationship ensuing.  And it's not about being "picky", it's about not settling for something less than you really want (and hopefully deserve) and then having to do this whole dating BS all over again sometime down the road.  I really don't want to be on dating websites when I'm in my 80's......just don't see how that could be a good thing. 

   But my Match subscription expires next week.........and I'm going to try the new "hottest" online dating website.  Can't tell you the name because then all the guys reading this will join and skew the "girls to guys" ratio........which currently is in my favor.  Yeah, I'm selfish....I know.  I threw up a couple pics and said I'd be on there shortly in my profile......and I'm getting bombarded with "this one wants to meet you" and "this one sent you a message", etc emails.  So we'll see how that goes, but I have my doubts.  I'm not expecting much, as where I live is not heavily populated......so pickin's is slim.  Most of the women are in the wealthy suburbs of Washington DC are really just looking for vacation partners and travel buddies to carry their luggage, so again, not my type.  I may have to resort to FarmersOnly.com and find a nice country gal, that hopefully has some teeth.  So we'll see.  Ask me again in a few months how I'm doing.  Although with this MyShirona virus thing going on there won't be much dating anytime soon.  So maybe ask me again around Christmas.  At the very least I'm sure I'll have a few good stories for you......I won't disappoint.  Promise. 

   Hey.........did you check out my new kittens???  You know you want one.......don't you little girl?

Always good talking to ya K.........stay safe!

regards,

bob 

Fri May 01, 2020 6:25 pm

OK Karen, now I’m really upset. You have way more than a little knowledge. In fact it’s kinda embarassing that a Canadian seems to know a heck of a lot more about my government than most of my fellow Americans. I don’t disagree with anything you’ve written though my opinions might differ a little. I think your “musings” are supported by a good deal of research which only reinforce my opinions.
I have loved my country since I was able to understand the differences between right and wrong, war and peace, freedom and constraint and democracy and most other forms of government. As I understood it better I loved it more. Until recently but I won’t go into that until I learn more from you and Bob.
I also want to thank Canada for Celine Dion. Her performance of “God Bless America” is incomparable.
Thank you,
Mike

Fri May 01, 2020 7:38 pm

Mike,

  As you travel around the world you quickly are made aware that EVERYONE knows more about our Government than us Americans.  I was always dumbfounded when folks in other countries would bring up such things in conversation.  It was, and still is, embarrassing when you consider we know even less about other countries Governments.  I'll second Celine being a hottie.  She could sing too?  Hmmm......guess I preoccupied with other things to notice.  Damn bratty American that I am.  

Peace Out,

Bob


Fri May 01, 2020 8:58 pm

Celine Dion.....OK, but we're truly sorry about Justin Bieber. 

Fri May 01, 2020 10:05 pm
iMacG5 wrote:

OK Karen, now I’m really upset. You have way more than a little knowledge. In fact it’s kinda embarassing that a Canadian seems to know a heck of a lot more about my government than most of my fellow Americans. I don’t disagree with anything you’ve written though my opinions might differ a little. I think your “musings” are supported by a good deal of research which only reinforce my opinions.
I have loved my country since I was able to understand the differences between right and wrong, war and peace, freedom and constraint and democracy and most other forms of government. As I understood it better I loved it more. Until recently but I won’t go into that until I learn more from you and Bob.
I also want to thank Canada for Celine Dion. Her performance of “God Bless America” is incomparable.
Thank you,
Mike


Hi Mike,

It is knowing when to stop  going down the rabbit hole that is important and  to "look on the sunnyside of life." This is all one needs - to listen to another Alberta gal - K.D. Lang sing Michael Cohen. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tcOQSk_cMO0 

I remember when my kids were in Grade 9. They had to learn all the states and territories, their capitals, the major rivers and bodies of water and the primary and secondary industries - actually so did I, come to think of it, so when someone I run into, in any state - even Montana, believe it or not, and I tell them I am from Edmonton, some even ask how far it is from Toronto. We studied different continents in each year of upper elementary and junior high (middle school).

Maybe you missed this liitle bit that might have got lost in this thread.  In case the link doesn't work the title is Clark W. -Up Here in Canada https://www.google.com/search?q=Clark+w.+up+Here%2C+in+Canada&oq=Clark+w.+up+Here%2C+in+Canada&aqs=chrome..69i57.1880j0j7&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8  This explains why I is what I is.
 

And, you might be interested in this view. Chris Hedges, "America: The Farewell Tour"  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeE5WnTUsF8&feature=youtu.be It is over an hour though - may even put one to sleep. 

K

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