I recently noticed a change in the Hollister pouches that I have used for years. It's the New Image drainable pouch #18122. Anyway, if you happen to use Hollister products, here's what I noticed: (1) a new sheen to the pouch, and (2) the material is obviously thinner, and (3) it now crinkles when you're fiddling with it. I emailed Hollister who, in their response, admitted that they "recently needed to make a change to the film we use in our pouches... we have been made aware that some customers have issues about the change." Note they used the plural: "pouches." I infer from that they have similarly altered other pouches than just the model that I use. I called them. The rep said that the change was made necessary for "environmental reasons," but when I pressed for a more detailed explanation, he was not responsive. I suspect, based strictly on observation, that the change has been made as a cost cutting/profit increasing device, as the pouch is clearly less thick. Here's my fear: that the clearly less substantial pouch will tear on me when I'm cleaning the spout. Thus far, this hasn't happened. I'm on a 3-day wearing schedule. I was told they would send me some alternate samples to consider and I'm awaiting arrival of that now. So, if you're a Hollister user, check the pouches most recently purchased.
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A lot of folks using Hollister are saying the very same thing. I don't use their bags, just the barrier rings, but I don't like what they did anyway. Next, they are gonna make the bags smaller. Their barrier wipes are smaller than a prep pad. They used to equal approximately half the size of a tissue. Meanwhile, back at the ranch, they will market them as 'new and improved' and charge more while they laugh all the way to the bank. I'm stepping off my cynical soapbox now.
I noticed a difference in Convatec too. They are crinkly and they have a lotion or oil on them, I think, to try and keep them supple. And the flange doesn't seem to last as long as they used to.
What is going on? For what they charge for these things, they should be indestructible.
Hi Henry,
As Torquey noted....we talked about this a few months back. I posted the topic "Hollister 18104 Bags Now Fully Transparent....did you notice?" back on Oct 9th and Lovely posted on Nov 24 entitled "Change in Pouches", both about what you are talking about. We were bitching about the new cheaper feeling (and thinner, more transparent) material. I'm guessing they made the material change across all their lines of product. I use their 18104 bag, and had the same concerns as you. But since using them a couple times here's what I can tell you. The crinkling noise only seems to manifest itself when the bag is new and not on your body. I never heard it once installed. The material is thinner, so the clamshell clip feels looser, but it never leaked. From a durability standpoint I'm not 100% sure it's as good as the older material, but I haven't ripped, torn or punctured the new bags yet. What I really don't like is the much more transparent nature of the bag. It's pretty obvious what's in the bag with either material, so I don't know why it bothers me so much......but it does. I'd much prefer a clear window or subsection of the bag than the whole bag being transparent. And I tended to prefer the older less transparent material to the fully opaque bags I also have. I just like the idea of seeing what the heck is going on in there during the day. Maybe for me with my high output and much varied consistency of crap it's more of a big deal than for others.
In a way it's a good thing because I need to force myself to start wearing the fully opaque bags once I start dating.........and I needed the push. The thing that pissed me off more than anything is that Hollister never told anyone their products were changing. I didn't know it until I got my 3-month supply of ostomy products, opened a box, and thought someone had made a mistake and sent me the wrong item. Then I called the medical supply company and they told me it was the new normal for Hollister. They weren't my favorite company to begin with, but this change didn't help.
Regards,
Bob
These days, Torque, cynicism is necessary to survive, so don't sweat it. The fact that medical supply companies are part of the countrywide corporate greed syndrome is not news. Consumers don't have much of a voice. We need more Liz Warrens.
Very simple, NancyAnn, but nothing new: corporate greed is present in all medical products producers.
Hey there, Bob. I missed the earlier comments that you reference. I agree that Hollister's failure to notify customers sucks. When they discontinued the model I used to use, they provided notice, so it's not that hard to do. I'm happy to hear you haven't suffered a torn or ripped pouch as yet, 'cause that's my major concern. They have sent me a sample alternate pouch that's smaller than the one I use, but it otherwise appears to be the same less substantial material. I might give the smaller one a try for going to the gym and walking. Thanks again for responding. Henry M.
That was my experience with the 18183's. At least certain batches at the corners of the Velcro had a tendency to slightly tear if you pulled a bit crooked or too hard when emptying. When this happened, you wouldn't necessarily even see the tear, but shortly thereafter you'd sure smell it. It was certainly a problem if I happened to be out. My wife and I have a Wednesday standing date for cocktails at a place we like. You can imagine the problem of sitting at a bar in rather close quarters with that problem suddenly developing after using the restroom. It would be like an un-bagged person having uncontrollable gas.
I use the 18103 bags and they were changed also. I was like Bob said when I got my first order after the change, I thought I had gotten the wrong order and I called also. The next order I got had a pamphlet explaining about the change. The crinkling noise on mine continues all the time. The bag seems to let the odor come through sooner and has to be changed more often than the old ones. They did send me a sample of one that you cannot see through at all, but I also like to see what comes through. Bob posted good pictures of three different bags and you could see the big difference in them.
I was looking for a high volume solution that Hollister didn't offer.
I've moved over to Coloplast.
I contacted them about getting samples and they sent me an online survey about my stoma and output, etc. In a week or so, I got about a two-week supply of various products. I talked with Jessica Wald at Coloplast, and she sent me another two weeks of product that addressed my feedback.
Her contact info is:
Jessica Wald
Coloplast Consumer Sales Representative
1-855-430-9500
Convatec has changed their bags. They are thinner and more crinkly. I called them asking about the change and they told me there hadn't been a change that they knew of. That's a bunch of BS. It's really annoying. We wear the darn things all the time so we know. They must think we are all stupid. Grrrrr.
I saw an advertisement for the new and improved pouch from Convetec. I called and they sent me some samples of the two-piece drainable pouch. It does crinkle more. It is supposed to have an improved filter but with liquid output, it seeped through the filter. There is a peek hole that I do like. You can just peek in to see your stoma and that is all! I love that part. It does seem cheaply made compared to the previous pouch. That clear lining is the true change. Cheap and thin. There is really not much change other than that and it has not adjusted my wear time. I am waiting on another set of samples for the improved closed-end pouch that I have been using more than a drainable. It cuts down on the odors when changing versus draining. Hopefully, the filter is more improved than just bigger. I find myself keeping a sticker, that they provide, over the filter most of the time anyway but still like having the option so I don't order the ones without. I had just received my 3-month supply in Jan. when I saw this ad and they came to me as the same ones I always use so they did not just change up on me. Probably because they have to use up the old products first! I am sure I will not have a choice in my next order.
I understand they are always trying to improve their pouches but the bottom line always gets in the way so the quality is affected. Sad!
Puppy
I think trying to sell the environmental reason is humorous for changing their product. The impact of used pouches is somewhere between very little difference and no difference at all. I'm sure they changed suppliers to cut costs, maybe Chinese or Vietnamese made now, and these materials are all that is available in those places. It seems to me any savings from these new pouches will be offset by people finding a new product that is acceptable and leaving Hollister. Good luck! I use Coloplast and think they are the best!
Hi Darturbo.
I use Convatec but am not very happy with the changes they have made to their bags...not sure where Convatec are made...Coloplast are made in Denmark so probably a good choice. I'm going to check Coloplast out next week at my local supplier.
Cheers.
Ange.
Coloplast is far superior in quality than Convatec, but they have a completely different system on the two-piece, and it is horrible. It malfunctions because it is so hard to get on! If you wear a one-piece, you should not have any problems with them. I refuse to deal with that click system! You just cannot burp it without a big to-do!
pup
In 2009, I had my urostomy performed. I started with Hollister products. It seemed every day I would have a product failure and leakage. I use a two-piece system. It usually was the pouch failing. The seams on the bottom of the pouch would open, causing a big leak. Also, the barrier would fail too. The fabric backing, which had the adhesive on it, would get waterlogged from urine and just come loose. With Convatec products, I had constant problems with leakage also. I now use Coloplast SenSura Mio two-piece and have the best results. While I still have the occasional leak, the Coloplast product is the best for me. Compared to Hollister and Convatec, the Coloplast pouches have the best quality. This is just my experience.
I've been using the Hollister 8331 pouches for several months now and noticed the "crinkly noise" a couple of weeks ago. No problems so far, but I wonder if they changed anything else in their quest to lower costs. I've been on a seven-day change schedule with this pouch and never had an issue. I'm VERY happy with this item, but I noticed at the last change that the adhesive might not have held as well as previously experienced. I was close to sprouting a leak.
Anyone else noticed this in a Hollister product?
Steve74041
Hi Steve,
I haven't noticed any changes to my Hollister barriers or barrier rings... only to the bags. I'm willing to cut Hollister some slack with the bag material change, at least until I've given them a fair workout. Polymer technology continues to improve and although the bags feel cheaper (and are), that doesn't mean they're not actually improved. You wouldn't want to still be stitched up with cat gut, now would you? Improvements will continue to come to all things medical. What I won't cut Hollister any slack for is not telling us about the bag material change before or even after they made the change. Not good Hollister... not good.
Regards,
Bob
Bob, did you not get a flyer in your last order about the change? I got one in my second order. I am thinking they had a lot of boxes out there without the change.
Hi Lovely,
No, I never get a flyer or any other notification with my last order. When I called them (CCS Medical), they had no clue that Hollister had made any changes to their bags.
Regards,
Bob
Other than the issue I noted with my original posting, I like my Hollister product. The skin barrier (#11202) is thin, light weight, easy on and off, and has never, ever leaked. Your 7-day change schedule surprised me. I go three days. I could probably go longer but, given that it only takes a few minutes to change over in the morning when I get up, I choose not to risk discomfort, skin irritation, or other problems by pushing the envelope.
I have an urostomy and use a two-piece Hollister system. Like the rest of you, I was not notified of any forthcoming
change to the material (18402) and find it rather arrogant of the supplier that they did not consult with the
customer/end user.
I was also apprehensive re: the strength of the material as I have to 'break' the internal join of the bag
as I have an indwelling catheter through the stoma. The catheter will not fit if I do not make an allowance
for it in the bag.
However, saying that, I have used the 'new' style bag for a few weeks and, so far, no dramas!
It's not bad, but it would be nice for them to say it from the time before applying some changes. However, I'm not even surprised. Big companies use many tricky hacks to save and make a profit, choosing money, not quality. They use people's inattentiveness. The clothes get thinner; you won't find a t-shirt today with the same good and thick cotton cloth we have worn in the 90s. Today's t-shirts are toxic for our bodies, and we can see our bodies through this thin fabric. That's why I wouldn't say I like today's companies and popular things. I prefer quality and use only quality bags and products from interplas.com
