Sexual Intercourse After Ileostomy and Adhesion Surgery - Seeking Advice

Hello,

I began to formulate this very question to my male surgeon, and he got so embarrassed he mumbled something incoherently and said he'd send me in a female surgeon to speak to me about it. Well, she never showed up, and I am left with no answer. I am 6 weeks post-op and can tell my body is not healed enough yet. But my main man and I long for one another. It's been approximately 10 months since I became too ill to have intercourse, and we are very frustrated but willing to be as patient as needed. Any response regarding any of these issues will be readily appreciated.

Thank you.

Hey Kahlo, What's that?  Just kidding.

As long as you don't injure yourself shouldn't you try?  Also, I'm told there are alternatives to intercourse that might be satisfying.

What do I know?

Mike

I think, like everything else about an ostomy or surgery. Take it slow, stop if it hurts and don't look back!
Puppyluv

If there is a will, there is a way. Whatever position works.

Hello KAHLO.
Thank you for this post, and thanks for all the great responses so far.
Being extremely cynical about most of the medical profession, I was wondering why you thought a doctor would be able to give you advice on when you could or should have sexual intercourse. It’s a wonder he didn’t prescribe you medication for this condition!!
Seriously, like other people have said, it is a very personal choice and if you take it slowly to see what happens I feel sure you will both find out if and when it is the ‘right’ time.
I used to have many dilemmas like this concerning medical advice or none as the whims would take them and I resolved it by prescribing my clients SOCSAPINE at 5ml. per day, and 120 ml when appropriate.
It was a very effective regime which is captured in the rhyme below:
Best wishes
Bill

SOCSAPINE ©:
A MOST EFFICACIOUS TREATMENT.

SOCSAPINE, the most efficacious treatment ever seen.
Over thousands of years, Socsapine has been.
Crucially useful to people exceptional.
So not often used by those more dysfunctional.
A treatment so good that most will succumb.
Prescribed by the minute with positive outcome.
Indeed, it is said, that it’s also ‘cost-free’.
Nothing to pay. That sounds good to me.
Even the cynics must surely agree.

B. Withers (2009)

Socsapine can be defined as:
Self - Organised Common-Sense Alongside
Practical Involvement in Normal Experiences.

Socsapine is by no means a new ‘treatment’ for ailments
of modern living, particularly where these involve
cognitive, emotional and dysfunctional elements.
Socsapine has been about for thousands of years and
there have been many books written on the subject.
Socsapine has been tried and tested by the majority of
‘functional’ people within the population
who use it on a daily basis.
Socsapine is notably, not a treatment that is favoured by
‘dysfunctional’ people. Particularly not those who
are maintaining dysfunctional systems, organisations and activities.
Socsapine can be prescribed in flexible doses at between
10ml – 20 ml per day and 120 ml PRN (as needed)
Socsapine can be cost- ‘free’ at the point of delivery.
Socsapine has very few undesired side-effects.

Socsapine dosage is measured in ‘Minutes Long’ (ml)
My preference is to recommend starting at between
10- 20 minutes length per day,
and 120 minutes length when really needed.

Socsapine...Bill, you've done it again! Keep me chuckling. Common sense stands out the most to me.

Kahlo. I truly do not know as I have not been 'intimate' with anyone in a long time. I might seek the advice of an ostomy nurse. There is a wound care/ostomy clinic downtown where I live, and they have been very helpful. Plus, I always recommend seeking one out even if you don't have issues right now; they can help later on down the road.

Thanks so much, Bill.  I know something was missing but couldn't remember what it was. SOCSAPINE!  There it is.  I've been critical of others acting or just talking like they have no idea what's really going on while I'm struggling to offer advice with no recollection of how I handled a situation myself.  It's the Socsapine; I stopped using it.  I began thinking I had all answers to all the questions just because I knew a little about some stuff.  Taking a step back, I found lots of unopened containers of the wonder drug and immediately began replenishing me deficiency.  I won't let that happen again.

Graciously thankful,

Mike

Those enhancing things can be trouble for those on high blood pressure meds, Mike, Socsapine or not. On a humorous note and with all apologies for being non-serious on a serious subject: A feudal landlord from Lahore (you know where that is) and who had many heart problems asked his cardiologist if he could engage in sex with his willing partner. The doctor replied, "Well, you know that can have serious consequences, one can die." His answer: "Well, if she dies, she dies."

Kahlo, has anyone spoken to you about vaginal dilators? I don't know if you had radiation or not, but one of the late effects can be a narrowing of the vaginal walls. To prevent it from becoming permanent, one needs to use vaginal dilators and a good water-based lubricant. I would advise you to speak to a physician who is emotionally mature enough to cope with the concept of female sexuality, or a wound care or stoma nurse. The dilators come in different sizes; start with the smallest size, and work your way up. When you can comfortably accommodate the dilator that best matches the size of your aroused partner, you are probably ready to try intercourse. But like many have said before me, take it slow, and stop if it is painful. Your next step would be to consult a gynecologist, and I would suggest a female. (Male gynecologists, I have found, are prone to gaslighting - your pain is all in your head - which is unhelpful to say the least.) Dilators can be found at sex shops, although I was given a set at the hospital - but I had to ask for it! You might want to consider trying dilators regardless of whether you had radiation, as it has been such a long time since you had intercourse. Narrowing of the vaginal walls can happen just with a lack of activity. Hope this is helpful. Feel free to ask questions if you have them. Good luck.

How long would it take for you to get here? I have to tell you that my wife has become a non-conformer in the bedroom. She nursed me back to health but seems like she's afraid to touch me. In the last 6 years, I can tell you it's been less than ten times. But as for when you can resume sex? It's up to you. Start easy and if you feel any pain, stop. I'm not trying to be a smart ass but try masturbating a few times first. I know I had a lot of pain with an ejaculation at first. Make sure you can handle an orgasm. No sense in leaving a guy hanging if you have pain. Also, it could affect future moods with that person. If I didn't love my wife so much, I'd be cheating. I had more sex when I was single than I have in recent years. Don't get me wrong, everything works great but she's been turned off because of my reactions of pain. I hope this helps. Like I said, I'm not trying to be a smart ass and hope the best for you.

Hi Kahlo,

Here's what I've found and tried. Ask your MD to refer you to pelvic physical therapy. This will help determine if tissue has atrophied, if there are adhesions to work out. It may be too soon-- but at some point this is really helpful. Have your doctor, radiologist or oncologist give you a set of dilators- test each size and work with them to get comfortable for intercourse. Use YES organic lubrication. Get vaginal lubrication/nutrition cubes with low dose Estriol and DHEA- you can use 1/2 a cube or a whole cube-- company is Bezweken-I see it's being sold on Amazon too. No chemicals, only good ingredients. Low dose DHEA, 5 mg, maybe every other day or every 3rd day for a month or so. It may be a process. Get your partner on board to gently help bring back function and pleasure.

There are two kinds of dilators- hard plastic and soft silicone. Both are helpful for different reasons. The hard ones help you target the tight areas and release them and help stretch out the tissue. The soft ones help because they are more pleasurable once the repairs are made and help hold the vaginal space in muscle memory to the size of your partner. Hard dilators: Syracuse Medical Devices- usually your doctor will give you a set of 3 or four, small, med, large. But there are some in-between sizes that are helpful you can buy on your own. Soft dilators from Soul Source, silicone vaginal dilator- lot of sizes. Good luck! Stay with it. Once it's comfortable, and you keep making love, you will not need them as much or at all. There are also vibrators and dildos from your local sex shop too.

Hello KAHLO. (in reply to your post)
I know from personal experience that low blood pressure can cause all sorts of problems for the 'sufferer' and my experiences with the medical profession make me very cynical as to whether they can do anything at all to help with it. For years I went to doctors asking about my symptoms of fatigue and exhaustion, only to be told that I was probably overworking. On one occasion when I was in hospital, they told me that my blood pressure was dangerously low and then it started to become clear what the problem had been all along. Apparently, there is not much they can do for this condition and it seems that they are more interested in treating people with high blood pressure than low. As for medics and their medication. After my heart bypass operation, they wanted to give me medication to lower my blood pressure; I took one pill and it made me pass out, so I immediately stopped taking it and got myself a blood pressure monitor to try to ascertain what was going on. I now know that my bouts of severe fatigue are directly linked to my low blood pressure, which in itself is worthwhile knowledge. I don't bother the doctors with this problem any longer because I cannot see the point in going to someone if they do not have any constructive solutions. Upon reflection, I think that the job I used to do (where all my colleagues suffered with high blood pressure) was probably beneficial to my health by raising my blood pressure up to what is considered 'normal'.
I have found that sitting, laying or simply doing nothing will only make things worse, so I try to be physically and mentally active, which can be equally exhausting, but in a different way.
Whenever I have problems that seem to be insoluble, I tend to write rhymes to capture the concepts. so below is just one about tiredness and exhaustion.
Best wishes
Bill

I GET TIRED.

My chronic illness makes me tired
and so it’s hard to get inspired.
So what I choose to do instead
is think that I should stay in bed.

But laying there I am inclined
to get more tired in my mind.
Then as that tiredness is built
I start to feel a twang of guilt.

To myself I chide and scoff
there must be people much worse off.
Just look around and you will see
there’s many people worse than me.

But then my mind will once again
focus on my chronic pain.
And whilst I may have empathy
my instinct is to apathy.

Because I do not want to shirk
I’ll force myself to do some work.
That’s in the hope that I’ll get tired
in ways that might be still admired.

So up I get and off I go
and smile, so people will not know
that all that time, way deep inside
my true feelings I will hide.

Because my feelings are repressed
I will tend to get depressed.
But still my duties I’ll fulfil
though I know it makes me ill.

But I get tired of it all
chronic illness, big and small.
And sometimes when it gets too rough
I simply feel I’ve had enough.

                                 B. Withers 2012

(From KAHLO)
Hello,
I wrote a reply and then looked and it seemed it didn't submit properly. You may be getting 2 slightly different responses. I am very mistrusting of the med system. Are you as well? Or have you had better results than me?
I want to really thank you for putting a smile on my face. Your reply was hilarious, smart and real. I appreciated it.
My complaints follow and know this I can not bear complaining. I'd much rather suck it up and tolerate any of my discomfort in silence. I can not mentally, emotionalyy or physically do this though and I am at a loss. Thank you in advance for listening to my ...woes.
I have no confidence left in the system here in the U.S. I've been re-hospitalized 2x for exhaustion and my doctor is almost a moron. I have tried many other doctors but keep coming back to her because the others are either like Nazis and not only impede my healing but my ability to heal and cause me to regress. At least my moron is a kind moron. I am truly traumatized by my experiences in the medical world. It leaves me hugely challenged to call upon their help or make any necessary trips to the E.R. or into Urgent Care.
I am not able to eat enough yet to create any real energy. Once the calories are used up I get a sensation like being kicked in the chest and need to collapse on to my bed. I am always dehyfrated and drink 1-2 bottles of Pedia-Lyte a day & still am dehydrated.
I had low blood pressure before the surgery and it was a real problem and after surgery it's dropped to 90/60 or 85/50.
I just can't seem to be able to get any traction. Does anyone have any advice for me? I am at a loss rt now and too deydrated to manufacture tears but I am filled with them. I have decided to Post this. Maybe other sto-mates may have something I can actually benefit from.
Thank you again for that smile and the wry humour. I am sarcastic in nature and always am up for a laugh esp as things get bleaker.
signed-
very low & feeling helpless

Your rhyme/poem nailed the yo-yo/merry-go-round/roller coaster theme of my life. It cuts me deep to my core to find a kindred spirit in you. I have been alone for so long living among healthy people. The isolation made me go crazy sometimes. We are social animals and it is unnatural to be 'wounded' and alone. So, thank you for sharing your insights and words.

I am doing a bit better. I am beginning to grasp the enormity of the amount of healing this poor body has in store and am beginning to panic less in reaction to all the going wrongs inside of my body. I learned from a wonderful specialized pelvic floor physiotherapist and now an amazing friend that the colon and intestines are where we process loss and grief. For those of us that no longer have colons and not much small intestine left, it is a real challenge for our bodies to process the chemical/hormonal surges that naturally occur. I have no knowledge of that but experiencing those very challenges have had to discipline my mind to do what my body cannot. It sure helps when you have skilled professionals that can impart more of this kind of info. I have felt lost and utterly different than most people because it seems everything's a challenge for me where they can take so much in stride. Lucky, lucky them.

How are you? Can you tell me something about yourself? Where do you live in the UK? I have a passion for history and other countries, especially the UK. I feel a kinship to your area though I've never been.

- xoe

Hello Xoe.
I am so pleased that you enjoyed the rhyme and thanks for letting me know, as it always good to get feedback on that sort of thing. You may have noticed that most of my rhymes focus on the 'challenges' in life, and therefore they are not to everybody's liking. However, they are usually written with a particular 'sufferer' in mind (sometimes that's me!) - so they are often very much appreciated by that person. When they are read by a wider audience, I never know whether they are going to be well-received or not. However, it doesn't really matter, as the primary purpose had already been achieved in the past.
You were asking if I could tell you ‘a bit’ more about myself. This is a much more complex question than you perhaps realise, and I have tried to ponder upon what ‘bits’ might be of most interest to someone like you (or anyone else!). My deliberations have led me to think that what ‘I’ feel might be of interest, may be just a long list of boring facts about a life of someone who has always struggles with the challenges of people’s ‘misery’ ( including my own). If you are really interested, I had a go at writing my memoirs in 2018 and I would be happy to send you an electronic copy if you were to message me with your email address.
Regarding where I live, it is a small market-town called Hitchin, in the county of Hertfordshire. As with most towns in the UK it has a long and eventful history, which you could look-up via Google if you so wished. I also has an almost unique claim to fame, inasmuch as it sits on an Artesian well, which is reputed to be one of the biggest in Europe. A few years back, I mapped out the area in terms of its springs and documented this in rhyme -which I share with you below:
Also, you could get a visual and documented account of some of the walks in my blog: Purwellvalley.blogspot.com However, such are the vagaries of the web, I now do not have access to my own blog site- so, there is no point in trying to communicate via that route.
Best wishes
Bill

THE RING OF PURWELL SPRINGS.
(A unique circle and walk –
On sand and gravel, clay and chalk)

The ‘Purwell’ name emerges from
The valley and the springs thereon.
It flows right to the Eastern coast.
But of its start I wish to boast.

Transport me back ten thousand years
Before the hordes of man appeared.
And In my mind, I visualise.
This place before it’s vandalised.

There is a story here to tell.
About a huge artesian well.
Formed from glacial melt by chance.
One would not notice at first glance.

I’ve been and seen and so I’ve known.
Each spring has beauty of its own.
Just one of nature’s wondrous things.
This unique ring of Purwell springs.

Along the Roman Icknield Way.
The first spring’s from a soil of clay.
A source of drink as you can tell.
The place they came to call Cad-well.

It’s good to start my journey here.
With man’s buildings nowhere near.
A spring that still looks wild and free.
That brings its own tranquillity.

Norton Common and Norton Spring.
Are just outside the Purwell Ring.
They join the ‘Ivel’ way downstream.
Thus not within the Purwell theme.

Much further to the East beyond.
There is a spring at Willian pond.
One more in this vicinity.
Is on the way to Wymondley.

Willian Pond is so well known.
On all the maps it’s clearly shown.
The one close by’s another thing.
A small, elusive little spring.

Within the next wood on your right.
Spring’s in a lake just out of sight.
It sits in someone’s garden now.
But can be viewed if you know how.

I’m not so sure you really should.
But you can see it from the wood.
Or you can walk the other side.
Because from there it does not hide.

Midway between each Wymondley.
On land right near the Priory.
Stands at the start as I recall.
Here springs the furthest spring of all.

Wonderful setting, beautiful scene.
Such pity that it’s rarely seen.
Is it that people do not care.
They treat it like it’s just not there.

I don’t wish to tell you fibs.
About the pond down at St. Ibbs.
The way the land and water lays.
The stream it seems to flow ‘two’ ways.

If you look close, I’m sure you can.
Perceive the sluice in bridge cum dam.
So when the water overflows.
Towards the Hiz I think it flows.

Westerly springs are wider spread.
The next one’s found at the Wellhead.
This river flows through Hitchin Town.
To meet the main-stream further down.

Well worth the wander on this stretch.
Take camera, paints or pencil sketch.
At times the stream just disappears.
Keep going - ‘till it reappears.

Not to be missed it must be said.
Are two springs down on Oughton Head.
Bear to the right along the lane.
Where spring has sprung its aqua vein.

Whilst walking through this beauty spot.
Take time to think of what we’ve got.
Along this stream’s a worthwhile walk.
For water flows from wall and chalk.

’Snailswell’ seems a descriptive name.
A place from whence the waters came.
A few small springs can last be seen.
Around about in Lower Green.

North West Purwell are springs galore.
Round Holwell there are many more.
Small and charming, neat and posh.
Wending their way to Ouse and Wash.

This trip around the ring of springs.
Was meant to highlight many things.
The ancient history of this place.
Its charm and beauty to embrace.

The ring of springs can demonstrate.
How rain and water can filtrate.
Via different layers in the ground.
Until through force of springs is found.

PURWELL SPRINGS is an apt name,
to illustrate this claim to fame.
So, I suggest that from now on.
We use this name sine qua non.
                                    B. Withers 2008

Hello Xoe.

Just as an aside, Whist I was searching for the above poem, I came across some more rhymes on the subject of tirednes and fatigue. If you are interested, I could post them on here. Just let me know. ~

Best wishes

Bill

Hello again, Bill,

I just finished reading your poem. I get a vivid picture of the springs. I love springs. I spend my time between Mass and Vt here in the US. The drive either way follows springs that turn into rivers, lakes, and large streams. There is something about moving, fresh water that is very life-sustaining. It always peaks my spirit to witness the life cycle of this water throughout the seasons we have here. Right now they have begun to rush. The ice & snow are melting and coming down from the mountains, creating this wonderful roar.  

After a long and challenging winter season, this roar from the waters touches something deep inside, causing nostalgia. I cannot wait for the life of spring to spring up around me and to melt away the feelings of isolation, hardship, & cold. Winters are always hard on me, and recovering from surgery in this season has been bleak at times. I hope to move to a kinder, warmer climate at some point when my body & bank account are stronger, ha ha.

I did not get to touch on your response about low blood pressure. What you experience sounds so similar to me. I have found the same with doctors. They have something for high b.p. but nothing for us low riders. All night I have to get up and move around to get my heart going enough to handle it slowing down and going into sleep. I take potassium, add salt to food, and if I have enough room in my belly, try to fit in a salty snack. My thyroid medication also helps a bit.

Thank you for telling me about your struggle with it and about yourself too.

xoe

Thank you so much for your advice and taking the time to answer.  

I hope this posts. I am still clumsy and not sure how to navigate this site. I'll get there. I am posting in regard to the liquid contents of my bag. In the hospital, I was told repeatedly that ideally the contents should be the texture of oatmeal. That has been rarely the case for me. Maybe once every 2 days, I will achieve that consistency. I am wondering if anyone else experiences this and if a liquid texture is not ideal and for what reasons. I keep myself well hydrated. I was diagnosed while recuperating from surgery in the hospital with exhaustion. I was then hospitalized after my discharge again for exhaustion and pain. I had a very long road of severe illness before my surgery and concluded that my persisting exhaustive state was due to that. Can anyone tell me if there is a correlation to tiredness and too many liquid bags to empty or is that just how it is for some of us? I am working on my vitamin and mineral loss by taking liquid supplements but am in search of a nutritionist to also help me in this respect down the line after I've gotten stronger and can travel easier and with the coronavirus, I'm apt to put many doctor visits or needs right now on hold.

Thank you all who reply - your comments have been invaluable to me even if I can't reply to everyone. Know that I am deeply appreciative.

Hello KAHLO.

I believe there to be many differing reasons for tiredness and fatigue, most people would agree that dehydration can be one of them. Liquid output sounds like a good contender for creating dehydration problems.  A nutriionist sounds like a good idea if you can find one who knows a bit about stomas.  My daughter is a triathlete and takes some stuff that help to combat dehydration and stimulates/ replaces deficient electrolytes. She kindly lets me have some when I am feeling particularly fatigued, and sometimes it works well and quickly. 

I hope this helps ion some small way

Best wishes

Bill