Seeking Non-Adhesive Stoma Seal Ideas - DIY Ostomates

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w30bob

Bill, this is mainly directed toward you, but I didn't want to exclude any DIY lurkers in the crowd. Have you ever constructed a barrier seal that isn't adhered to the skin? What I'm envisioning is a thick "O-ring" type seal that sits around the stoma and is held in place by a belt or strap. There needs to be some type of "spring" or mechanism between the strap and the O-ring to hold it against the stoma as you move, and I'm not coming up with any good ideas for that part of it. So I'm wondering if you or anyone else on here has come up with something that seals, but doesn't use adhesives to do it. If anyone has.........or just has an idea or two.......I'd love to hear it. You can keep the patent rights.........I promise.

Thanks,

Bob

Footie97

Bob

I am no engineer but I am thinking about an assembly like a radiator cap that is spring loaded, obviously need an opening for the stoma. I am not sure how we will get around the no adhesive yet but it's a work in progress

Clint

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Bill

Hello Bob.

Thanks for the post.

I did indeed try to develop devices that would act as a barrier/seal without adhesive. However, none of them worked practically, because the mucus seeped under the device and it slid around like it was on a skid-pan surface. In the end, I used the same devices with a medical adhesive spray and they worked perfectly. 

However. Coloplast have a two-piece irrigation sleeve that is designed to work without adhesive (ref: Assura -12836) and the part that goes on the skin is very much curved so that it forms a tight seal. I didn't like it much because the hole in the device was too large for my needs. However, I did attach it to the ouside of my own baseplate and it has worked very well for about two years. 

Please note: Any and all DIYers. I have also tried making up devices that push into the stoma (like the stoma plug except with a hole/holes so that it can still expel output / gas). I WOULD DEFINITELY ADVISE AGAINST TRYING THIS as, whilst in principle and practice they worked, in the sense of staying put without adhesive, they all had an unfortunate and unforseen side-effect. What happened was that the internal walls of the stoma squeezed through the hole/holes like an octopus can squeeze through almost anything that has a gap. Once the soft flesh of the stoma is on the other side of the hole/holes it is VERY,VERY difficult to squeeze it back again. BE WARNED, from someone who has had bitter and embarrassing experience of this effect. 

Best wishes

Bill

xnine

Some kind of suction cup thing with a hole in the middle might work. How about a small inner tube, the valve stem would have to be on the outside. Plastic wrap and a rubber band. Some kind of modified chastity belt. My brain is racing. That was fun.

Lily17

Wheeeeeeeee...! What a trip! LOL

Actually, I "see" where you're going with your ideas, Xnine.

To add to the conversation:

I also thought about a device that uses a vacuum to adhere to the exterior of the abdomen. An electrical version would require a battery to maintain the vacuum, and I can understand there could be a weight restriction to maintain the seal...

The engineering on this sort of tech could be tricky: there has to be enough balance between suction and unit weight to keep it from falling off. And, not so much suction that there is damage to the derma or stoma, or that the sub-dermal intestine is pulled through the stoma. Wouldn't want another herniation, either.

Anyone think to ask Sir James Dyson about this? )

Lily17 

 
Staying Hydrated with an Ostomy with LeeAnne Hayden | Hollister
MBT

Nu Hope makes a non-adhesive pouch that uses a silicone O-ring secured by a belt to achieve a seal. That said, I have not personally used this Nu Hope pouch or met anyone who does. There was a brief discussion a few years ago about it here on MAO. https://www.meetanostomate.org/discussion-forum/viewtopic.php?t=4657

Here is a link to the Nu Hope catalogue (starts on page 65). The pouch looks like keeping a seal might be interesting, but is recommended for people with severe skin allergies or chemical sensitivities.

http://nu-hope.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/Nu-Hope-Product-Guide.pdf

w30bob

Look at you guys go! Wow. So the hard part about this is having the seal around the stoma stay in contact with the abdomen as we move. What I was envisioning when I started this post was something like an O-ring sandwiched between the abdomen and a belt of some sort, to keep pressure on the O-ring. The problem with that is the solid O-rings I've worked with of the needed thickness would not be flexible enough to flex and bend with our bodies as we bend and twist. Silicone does come in different durometers (densities), but most are custom orders and not stocked in many configurations. I plan to look into it a bit.....but haven't had time recently. So maybe the lower durometer silicones, if available in large O-ring sizes might be viable. How the O-ring is held against the body is the second problem. Something like a StealthBelt isn't elastic enough to keep constant pressure on the ring at all times as we move. A spring of some sort might work, but adds complexity to something that needs to be simple. Maybe a StealthBelt like belt but with a very stretchy and expandable Spandex section over the O-ring to keep pressure on it.

Someone PM'd me today with a good idea.....don't use a solid O-ring, but one that's inflatable. I'd go that one better and simpler and suggest something like a memory foam O-ring with a thin silicone cover or skin on it. And it doesn't need to be a "round" ring either. It could be a square-sided ring with ribs on the flat sides that touch the abdomen and touch the belt (this might address the problem Bill had with the ring shifting position).......or maybe we could put a thin skin barrier membrane or film on around the stoma first that the silicone skin would "stick" to without an adhesive.

There are so many possibilities......but the payoff is HUGE. No adhesives or allergic reactions to them. Everything is reusable.....so no need to carry extra "supplies" with you. Easy to remove, clean and quickly re-apply. And wounded skin not directly under the ring would be exposed to the air and could heal quickly.

Obviously I'm oversimplifying......and we haven't talked about how to attach the bag......but who better to come up with an ostomy solution.....those of us who have to wear the damn things....or a bunch of folks who've never even put one on?

Keep the ideas coming.....it's all good food for thought!

Regards,

Bob

Puppyluv56

I don't have any skin issues so I never thought along these lines. I have thought more of the surgically inserted valve type apparatus that takes the place of a sphincter and you empty when you like or feel full. Just like a normal BM where we choose when to go, as a rule. I do know short gutted Ostomate may have less use of this or maybe just have to empty more often but the thought of no pouch or outer flange would be heaven. Just open the valve and let it go!
Just a thought!
Pup

Footie97

Had a dream last night about a magnetic O-ring. The obvious downside is that there would need to be one piece under the skin that would not break down and not have iron or nickel (possible allergic reaction). The other downside would be possible skin breakdown from pressure to hold the seal.

I think I need more sleep.

Clint

Lily17

Good morning, Puppy

I've actually wondered if an electronic "sphincter" couldn't be invented. Implanted by the surgeon during an ostomy surgery, or "retrofitted"? for a current ostomate. Sort of like a pacemaker for the heart, but a remote control-operated internal valve...

Lily17

Bill

Hello Lilly.
An electronic sphincter is a great idea, and it already exists for both urinary and anal problems. However, there have been quite a few problems with these procedures and devices which have necessitated further surgery to remove them.
I had the sacral nerve stimulation operation which not only did not work but made my legs start to go numb. When I went back to the hospital, there was a lady next to me who (after her operation) had gone completely paralysed from the base of the spine downwards. The surgeons suggested that they might have placed my device in slightly the wrong position and that I should try again. Needless to say, I declined on the grounds that if they cannot get it right first time, then they don’t deserve another go.
Some time ago there was a post on here about an implant which sounded like an artificial sphincter for the stoma. I found a registered patent for such a device, but as there don’t seem to be any follow-up studies, I must presume that they may have encountered the same sorts of difficulties as the anal and urinary devices,
Which had a somewhat off-putting caveat, that they had a high probability of complications and a high morbidity rate.
Best wishes
Bill

 


Artificial sphincter for use at stoma, or for the like purposes
United States Patent 4399809

Abstract:
The invention concerns an artificial sphincter comprised of a strip to be wrapped around the intestine, conduit, tube of the wearer's body, or the like. The strip carries either a single inflatable chamber that extends along its length, or parallel longitudinally extending chambers, or rows of separate chambers, wherein the chambers in adjacent rows are staggered longitudinally along the strip. Passages communicate among the chambers to maintain uniform pressure. A tube communicates into the chambers for selectively delivering fluid to inflate them or to permit them to be deflated. At least one wall of the chamber is flexible and elastic, and that wall faces in around the intestine, or the like, so that upon inflation of the chambers, the intestine, conduit, tube or the like is compressed and occluded. In a variant, the chambers are shaped to have a smaller cross-section toward one longitudinal edge of the strip and a larger cross-section toward the other longitudinal edge thereof.

 

Lily17

Hi, Bill.

The resulting numbness from this surgery must have been frightening!  Then to know of your roommate's results...  Yes, I think it would give many people pause when presented with Surgery #2.  I do hope you have been able to resolve the problem with your sacral nerve, Bill.

The multitude of different successful inventions and innovations there have been during the history of humankind, and all the designs which failed prior to the desired creation...  With a stomatic valve, there are bound to be complicating issues prior to success.  And, I agree with Bob:  who better to design this functional item than one or more ostomates?  :)

Lily17  

Bill

Hello Lily.

Thanks for your concern. The numbness in my legs went away as soon as they had removed the electrical stimulating device! 

What I did not carry on to say was that the literature about artificial sphincters suggests that when all these things have been tried and failed, then a stoma is the answer. Hence, from a medical point of view the problem has been solved.

From my point of view, I was clutching at straws and I never really believed that the sphincter was the problem in the first place. When they eventually found out that I had an internal anal prolapse, it all made much more sense. The fact that all the operations to fix that didn't work either, was the motivation to decide on a stoma. 

Best wishes

Bill

iMacG5

As the young Lady from Oklahoma mentions, I think Nu Hope might be a good place to investigate. I use a Nu Hope hernia belt immediately after changing the appliance. I really don’t have a hernia but I use it because it fits my Convatec appliance so perfectly creating even pressure circumferentially. That could be a starting point when considering eliminating adhesives.
Just thinkin’
Mike

Puppyluv56

Lily,

I actually talked to my surgeon about this. I told him I would do all the footwork if he would fund me to come up with a prototype! Lol. He cried poor mouth but thought it was a good idea. Not enough is going on in the Ostomy world to improve our quality of life modifying technology already available. Just seems there could be more advancements made. nbsp
Pup

Lily17

Hi, Pup.

As ever, it seems, "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" - and Bob squeaked!

There are several of us who have pondered the possibilities of medical science making this sort of advance, it appears. There is no telling when or how our lives will improve with our Dream Machine, or who will create the device, or modify an existing device, as you note. However, the important thing is to continue either consciously considering the idea or - at the least - keep it in mind; there is no telling when lightning will strike! :)

I'm so glad your surgeon didn't pooh-pooh your idea. We need to have medical professionals on board while this project takes shape!

Lily17

w30bob

Hi pup,

Yeah, all we need is a very famous person to get an ostomy and then ask for help publicly......think Michael J. Fox and Parkinson's. THEN we'll see some advancements. To be fair though, because infants have lots of intestinal issues.....and THAT squeak is heard.....I'm sure there are things being looked at behind the scenes that we're just unaware of that could benefit us as well. But once you remove something as complex as intestines......it's just plain hard to mechanically replicate the many functions performed. Something like a heart.....that is simply a pump.....is a piece of cake compared to something that needs to not only contract and expand......but also absorb nutrients and put them into the bloodstream. A mechanical sphincter sounds simple enough, except on the controls side......meaning how would it know when to actuate? Also, depending on the type of ostomy it's applied to....it could only be effective if behind it was a reservoir of sorts to replicate the storage and holding tank functions of a colon. So I'm sure folks are working on things behind the scenes.......but simply don't discuss the failures, which are many. But it sure would be nice, and a bit reassuring, to know someone is thinking of us and trying different solutions. Or heaven forbid.....actually asked us for input. Until then.......we can only tinker.....and dream.

Sweet dreams,

Bob

Puppyluv56

Hey Bob,

Exactly the conversation my surgeon and I had. Either a famous person or a scientist that gets an ostomy so they have some buy-in and it becomes personal. Shame that leaves the rest of us out of that loop! Oh well. We can only hope! They can do miracles in transplants, conjoined separation, and many other things, so I do not discount someone coming up with a mechanical sphincter! Lol

I will be glad to be the test dummy for any they come up with!
Pup